two thoughts (ok, three)

[lyssie]

1. Do Owen Harper haters love and adore Dollhouse? Vice versa?

2. Have seen trailer for 'Sherlock Holmes'. really? REALLY? Yeah, no. That looked worse than Transformers 2, which looked craptastic.

3. *vibrates impatiently for people to finish their femme_fics, so they can be posted*

Comments

[wiliqueen.livejournal.com]

I hate Owen quite a lot, though I find him tolerable post-mortem.

I love Dollhouse (though "adore" would be pushing it), but have avoided fannish interaction outside my own LJ in part because I fear running across some idjit defending/woobifying Topher the way people do with Owen, and having to destroy them. Or give myself a stroke sitting here yelling about having to destroy them. Whichever. Either way, the consequences would be unpleasant. Early on I saw someone (you?) compare Topher to the handler/voyeur asshat on Bionic Woman, but he's turned out to be soooo much more of a waste of skin. I can't even.

DH is problematic as all hell. However, I have a long history of loving problematic things -- I'm a horror fan, for starters.

[wiliqueen.livejournal.com]

though I find him tolerable post-mortem.

Addendum: And it's possible that was the Vicodin talking. I've only attempted to watch S2 (and only got about 3/4 of the way through) immediately after oral surgery.

[meganbmoore.livejournal.com]

Oh, Topher is, as near as I can tell, the most popular character in the fandom and the fandom's woobie.

It makes us want to hurt things, it does.

[wiliqueen.livejournal.com]

I can't even begin to be surprised. *sigh* I'm going to choose to believe the proportion is inflated by how many sane people are not touching the show in general with a thirty-foot pole. It doesn't make much of a dent in the depressing, but.

*giggling a LOT at your icon*

[meganbmoore.livejournal.com]

I really hope that's right. Of course, I've been told in my LJ that it's redundant to talk about rape, the original owners of the bodies have no rights, and I should focus on how fascinating the employees and clients are, so...

[wiliqueen.livejournal.com]

Ew! Ew ew ew ew ew ew ew ew ew EW!!!! :: brushes off cooties ::

*sigh* The show is problematic. The fandom is what keeps squicking the everloving hell out of me. Ew.

(And that icon is MADE ENTIRELY OF WIN. I had my mind made up to stop watching right up until that very moment.)

[waterdaughter.livejournal.com]

God almighty. And people wonder why I want this show to go away.

[meganbmoore.livejournal.com]

I watch it, and I want it to go away.

And, like, I have'nt seen it myself, but I've been told there are even people who defend Priya being sold to the Dollhouse by the guy she rejected so that he could have her programmed as whatever kind of sexbot he wants?

Like, thankfully, I haven't seen it (though I have seen that only the SELLING is wrong, once the imprints were PROGRAMMED to want him, it was ok, because somehow, the tools of victimization and exploitation are more important thant he victims) but I'm told it's out there. TWOP, I think.

[waterdaughter.livejournal.com]

I FUCKING CALLED THAT. One of my friends with whom I was debating the "Dollhouse is a pile of shit" thing with said that he thought the viewers were supposed to be creeped out by Topher, whereas I figured he'd turn into the fandom's darling. God, I hate being right. Seriously.

(Although it was amusing- a couple weeks after this (http://waterdaughter.livejournal.com/125631.html?thread=545215#t545215) conversation, I got an IM from my friend saying "it hasn't gotten any better. This show is terrible." And apologies to anyone out there who does like it; it's just violently Not My Thing.)

[meganbmoore.livejournal.com]

Oh, I've thought from his first scene that we were supposed to like Topher and find him cute and funny. Just like Ballard is the hero and it's sososo sympathetic how Boyd loves Echo sososo much but must take part in her victimization and exploitation.

Guess who the 3 characters I hate are.

[wiliqueen.livejournal.com]

he thought the viewers were supposed to be creeped out by Topher, whereas I figured he'd turn into the fandom's darling. God, I hate being right. Seriously.

I think both are true, actually. The fact that he is funny and woobifiable makes him creepier.

[lilacsigil.livejournal.com]

Hate Owen. Am ambiguous about and rather squicked by Dollhouse.

[drake57.livejournal.com]

Dollhouse got renewed,still haven't seen it.

I liked Owen but i'm probably insane :)

[miera-c.livejournal.com]

Owen is the Torchwood guy? I dislike him but do not actively hate. I think they went way too far in the pilot to be able to bring him back to being likeable. I do think he's at least got some bit of depth as a character, which does not make him likeable but does make him interesting to watch.

Though the Owen defenders who try to argue he's not really a rapist infuriate me.

And Dollhouse, well, you know my opinion on that. ;)

[greycoupon.livejournal.com]

1. Owen was the Torchwood pilot rapist?

I can't deal with the second half of your question.

[scarfman]

I don't have strong enough feelings about Owen or Dollhouse that I can articulate them.

[foenix.livejournal.com]

I like Owen *and* Dollhouse.

But we know I'm a nut. ;)

[endis-ni.livejournal.com]

I take the view that Season 1 Owen and Season 2 Owen (even before all that happened to him) were, to all intents and purposes different characters. So I really disliked Owen in Season 1 (seriously, writers, that pilot was a monstrous lapse of taste and intention) but got to like him in Season 2 where he was far less predatory.

*Reads previous comments* Wait, people like Topher? Really? He's a giggling moral vacuum! He's one improbable lab accident away from becoming a supervillain! But not a cool one, one of those erratically science-based ones the hero beats up in the first six or so panels of the comic.

[wiliqueen.livejournal.com]

I have no comprehension of how anyone can like Topher, but considering fandom's habit of woobifying actual supervillains, I'm not surprised. :-P

[endis-ni.livejournal.com]

Oh gods, don't remind me. I'll never understand why Fandom_Secrets went mental over the Joker.

I can understand why people would like Boyd, who's at least compassionate (not enough to save all those vulnerable childlike people from being used as glorified whores/RealDolls, though) or Doctor Saunders, who's more sinned against than sinning. But Topher? I'd sooner develop an affection for bloody Alpha.

[noybusiness.livejournal.com]

I don't mind Owen. Except when his character faults are acting up.

I like Dollhouse a lot. Topher has to be my least favorite character. How anyone can like him is beyond me.

[holdouttrout.livejournal.com]

2. Yeah...I think I'm with you on that. I mean...what, exactly, was Sherlock Holmes-y about that?

[lyssie.livejournal.com]

I'd be ok, if it were all, "Here is our cracky neo-victorian farce." But it ain't Holmes.

[ellestra.livejournal.com]

1. I like both Owen and Dollhouse. I like watching fucked up things. Just as long as they are fiction.
And now that you've mentioned it I think Owen would fit perfectly well in the Dollhouse. He has that flexible morality that one would need to work for it. The ability to overlook and justify wrong stuff.

2. Lately all trailers seem the same to me. And not in a good way.

[timjr.livejournal.com]

1. I really did not like Dollhouse for, like, up until the last three eps of the season (And I only watched it because I was bored and hulu had nothing better, really). And that's when we really were at the point of where I thought the show acknowledged that the Dollhouse, as an organization, was freaking evil and terrible on a basic human rights level.

Owen, well, I don't dislike him. But I find you can't just ignore what he did in the first ep, definitely.

2. Okay, I just watched that trailer, and laughed a lot. It looks ridiculous. Like... Sherlock Holmes redone in the manner of 'The Mummy'. Sadly, given I love 'Young Sherlock Holmes', I'm probably not the best judge of Holmes purity.

[viciouswishes.livejournal.com]

I dislike both Owen and Dollhouse. But I'm a well-known h8ter.