BSG last night, I have more thoughts.

[lyssie]

Spoilery, etc, may reference some Farscape stuff that I'm going to attempt to keep from being spoilery--

1. Kara in her viper, searching for Leoben? = John Crichton, searching for wormholes. And OH does that weirdly make it better in my brain. For some reason.

2. If Kara = John, that makes Sam = Aeryn, and Aeryn... man. ok. That does kinda, scarily, work. HEY KARA, NO TAKING DRUGS, GOT IT?

3. Leoben may not think Sam and Kara are destined to be together forever, but Sam is destined to be with her, for the moment. I think Leoben has slipped away from the idea that he and Kara are destined to be together, and now subscribes to some sort of wacky, "she's too high up for him" thing--

4. --either that, or he concedes that Sam is the better Cylon man. SHIT. I wanna see Leoben's face when Sam's origin is revealed. IT WILL BE CLASSIC.

5. Which still means Sam totally is fated to be with Kara Thrace.

6. NO COIN TOSSES ALLOWED.

eta: 7. One more thought, about Sam and his body language in the "lemme tell you 'bout the alliance" scene:

When Sam is relaying the stuff from Leoben and offering an alliance, he's very... Trucco and Tahmoh are the same height, but Sam is leaning forward, making himself almost the shortest person at the strategy table. It's a nice little psychological trick. He's also using his "I'm the leader of the resistance, I know best, and you will frakkin' obey me" voice.

But. Gentled.

It's not until people start picking on his wife that he straightens, looking a little angry.

Comments

[alryssa.livejournal.com]

I think the big difference though, is that nobody thought John was *totally* losing it, because he wasn't the only one who thought wormholes existed...

[lyssie.livejournal.com]

Well, not entirely, no. But there are chunks of season three where he's obsessed and the rest of Moya is going around, thinking he's completely fahrbot.

[lyssie.livejournal.com]

That would also be an interesting confrontation--I'd love to see Lee and Leoben, actually. Leo would be sure to get in cracks about Daddy.

He knows... something. Not what Sam is, but something.

[cujoy.livejournal.com]

I think that Sam gave away ... something with his reaction to Leoben's statement about "This is not all that we are." I think that Leoben took that reaction and ran with it.

According to Bear McCreary on his blog, Sam thought that Leoben knew. But I thought that it was more ambiguous.

[lyssie.livejournal.com]

Oh, Sam did give something away. I'm just not sure Leoben has an idea what it is, yet. Maybe, somewhere, he has an inkling (but then again, he's so in awe of the final five, would he feel like peon touching his God's boot in trying to 'help' Sam along his path?)

I wonder if Sam putting forward the alliance was in some way his attempt to avoid blackmail by Leoben, who might be able to cause everyone to doubt him?

[cujoy.livejournal.com]

Leoben went from the "This is not all that we are" statement directly to talking about Sam's life back on Caprica, and "C-Bucs rule!" etc. leading to "Waiting for your singular moment of clarity."

Leoben has repeatedly said that he can see the patterns that others can't. So he must have seen enough about Sam, given that strong reaction to his "first article of faith" jab to know he was hitting some kind of cord with Sammy. So Leoben may not have known specifically before he started talking, but he surely knows that something is up now.

I thought these lines were interesting towards the end of the scene:

"Allow our paths to converge. You save us from our savage brothers, and our old one, the Hybrid, will show Kara the righteous path. And together, they'll lead us to the promised land."

Leo invokes Kara, because he knows that will get to Sam. And I think the phrasing "OUR savage brothers" is very interesting, as opposed to "MY savage brothers."

And also. Leoben is afraid for his life in this scene. He's squirming because he's afraid that Sam might shoot him.

[lyssie.livejournal.com]

True. I think Leoben thought that might rattle Sam--I'm not sure it did, though I definitely think the "this is not all that we are" line shoved him over sideways, mentally. He was reeling there, for a bit--

otoh.

Does this mean that Leoben used to keep tabs on Sam, knowing he would one day become important to things? Which feeds back into Leoben being the first skinjob Sam encounters on Caprica, and makes me wonder...

How much of the C-Bucs' decision to stay around Delphi was influenced by Leoben--either directly, or inadvertently? Did Leoben see Kara arriving there and set Sam on the path to meet her?

It's funny, because I'd taken the 'our' to mean Leoben's and not Sam's, but maybe he was testing, poking to see how Sam would react.

Sam might really think Leoben knows.

Dude, Sam only didn't shoot him because--he pulled in Kara, and he said stuff that was practical, actually. Alliance? That's a practical thing, and Mr. I did not spend four months drinking myself dead every day when they took my wife--he understands that sometimes, there are logical, practical reasons for allying with the Cylons.

Not least of which, of course, is Sam proving that humans and Cylons really can work together.

[lyssie.livejournal.com]

YES. (I should have seen that one before, but, YES. omg)

[lyssie.livejournal.com]

Sadly, there will never be a chance for BSG muppet MPREG.

[lyssie.livejournal.com]

I KNOW. I'm now trying to figure out how plausible causing Rygel to carry Sam and Kara's baby would be.

If only because, y'know, it would be wrong.

[lyssie.livejournal.com]

hehehe. yays.

[noybusiness.livejournal.com]

Very wrong.

That's interesting. So is Hera/Nicky ship (I've been seeing that one coming since before I knew Nicky was half-Cylon). My most recent fanfic idea is "If the Five and the Seven weren't separated, how would things be different for the Colonials?"

[noybusiness.livejournal.com]

Er, not as something I myself would write.

[lyssie.livejournal.com]

Wrong is, like, my third middle name, at this point...

Hera/Nicky is almost inevitable give that, after Kacey, they're the only other kids on the show.

Ahahah. Things would be bad. For one thing, no Tigh, Anders, Tory and Tyrol? Galactica would be... in not so great shape. And Kara and Helo would probably be dead on Caprica.

[noybusiness.livejournal.com]

No Tigh, Anders, Tory, and Tyrol?

[noybusiness.livejournal.com]

That's not what I meant. I was thinking (A) they would be infiltrators like Boomer, Doral, Leoben, or Shelly Godfrey and/or (B) Cylon society might be different because of their presence.